PX Ban clarification

There are 46 replies in this Thread. The last Post () by Griffin.

    they completely ignored my post...which is fine by me i'd rather not get involved anyway (nor do i have any reason to)


    personally this whole thing is a waste of OP-R8R's time, other admins time, and time not used on something productive (like bring Epic RP stuff to the table)


    by no means am i speaking on his behalf, or anyone elses, but more placing myself in their shoes. If i was an admin and this was something that happened and got turned into a big to do, then yeah, i'd say "to hell with all this, so and so is banned because this is getting on my nerves"


    dont think i have anymore to say on this...

    Daywalker's last double posting (15 minutes ago) were too much, saying all that about OP again... speaking to him about despotism as he has no power in PX's forum neither over PX (though it was already proven wrong), and etc.


    I had enough of illusions as it could be contagious and start losing the sense of reality. It always was like this, and the slaps of reality he got were never enough, like in the last ASF/CSF battle results where he warned me, offered to mix results with me, then acted as being deceived on me and trying to hurt me on a personal level, then saying he gives up on CSF command (which he never did, not while he had an option), where the slap was the server logs of that battle offered indirectly by OP as he cared about the future of ASF/CSF, which is not very bright when leaders abandon. I can understand missing some kills, but not registering more kills than the real ammount.

    Chars: [CFPD]Michael~something (x25), [CFPD]~SQMS~{[(store)]} (x3), [CFPD]xfer, Event~Manager~Michael, StarfIier~EM~Michael, Event_Team_2, [GR]Michael[SP] and a blueprint of [CFPD]Sephirothis

    Alright... I'm going to give my $0.02 on this even though it's probably not even worth that...


    Seeing the state of affairs of the PX from my humble beginnings on Crossfire back in 2007 on up until now and seeing them go out in such a disgraceful way is very unfortunate and sad to watch... But perhaps this is more telling of Daywalker's true nature as well of some of the PX High Council unfortunately.


    The bottom line is this folks:


    You play by the rules in someone else's house or you get out, you are a GUEST, not a OWNER. It doesn't matter if you think they're wrong or not, or you think you are justified in your actions, you obey the in-house rules or get shown the door, THE END. I've seen this on many servers over the years in Freelancer and in other online games. YOUR OPPORTUNITY TO PLAY ON THIS SERVER IS A PRIVILEGE, NOT A RIGHT. Once you remember that, you'll never go wrong when playing online and it will force you to act accordingly. I think OP has given the PX as a whole countless opportunities to come clean and get straight over the years in their behavior and in various conflicts with other clans that I have been watching from the "side lines" so to speak,(and even involved in one of them with the SA) OP has been far more generous and forgiving than most server owners/operators would have been, much less myself.


    My only regret of this situation is that I only hope that some of the other members of the PX will decide to defect at least and be able to return to Crossfire sans the PX tag, if this is what it takes. I hate to see the actions of Daywalker bring down all the PX with him like Shockwave, Son of Angmar and numerous other level-headed PX members in my experiences. I do hope OP will consider reviewing these people's accounts as an per-basis situation and allow them the opportunity to return eventually.


    Regardless, my last words to you Daywalker, if you happen to read this, is TO MAN UP SIR. Accept the fact you've made a mistake, correct that mistake and ask OP for forgiveness so that the PX can return to Crossfire. Sometimes a little humility can go a long way in solving problems and sometimes our pride gets in the way of doing the right thing. Don't let your pride take the rest of PX down with you.


    Again as I said before, I hold no hostility or ill will towards you or your clan Daywalker(even though many I know of have and still do, because of your past actions) , my beliefs are that every man should be shown mercy, grace and forgiveness, even if they do not. So I hope you do make the right choice so that the PX are able to return to Crossfire. Even if that does not happen, good luck to you all in PX and may you be successful in your future endeavors, where ever that may be.

    maybe we should move on, enough were said about all of this ...

    despotism... really?
    well... its all about powers


    you know... there are people which earn their power by hard and dedicated work and there are people which take the power
    Cro did much work for this community... organizing and running events
    other event managers look up to him and he is organizing something very good for this community
    that is why he is leading the event managers... and that is why i leave it to him how the events are being done
    i have no reason to dictate anything to him


    I also dont tell clan leaders what they have to do and what not as long they do not break any rules.


    next example would be Huor which does an incredible job aswell
    His dedication has put him into a position that he got access to areas of the SWAT Portal that no other member ever had access to.
    ...Up to a point that i even considered him a good CF admin
    i just dont know if i would do him a favour offering such a position as i know that he is often very stressed by his jobs


    even the community is often asked for opinions before important decisions are being done
    despotism in my eyes looks different
    but if enforcing rules is the same as despotism then i am truly guilty


    PX had every change of getting heard here aswell of getting involved in all areas of the Portal
    but again I feel its a matter of power
    DW asked me to ban Cro a few weeks ago and in return his members would take care of the events. I believe huor could even confirm it as he always received a copy of the pms (god i love this forum).
    However... I refused knowing that PX took position in every forum group here at SWAT.


    We had a PX in the SWAT staff.... where i have to ask myself "why" since this PX moderator actually did nothing to help us at the Portal.
    We had PX represented 3 times at the clan leaders section where almost every by PX started topic was either an ultimatum to other clans or complaints against other clans.
    We had 1 PX that applied to the Event Managers group... well... you know how many events were run by PX (none).
    We had PX as GR representative... other than flying a ragnarok nothing has been done -> not even handing out CSF licences to the own members.
    And last but not least we had 3 PX members which applied to help with the Crossfire mod development. Aside from big words nothing was done in that area.
    It was btw. a PX which should write the CF1.9 short story (he said he would do it)... well... yeah... CF 1.9 was released months ago and we still have not even that simple short story.
    I dont know how it looks for you... but the more I think about all these small details the more questions rise about incidents which I noticed but decided to ignore.
    I mean... why was DW so much interested in getting the Clan management system at SWAT running (this discussion was done one the leaders board) when in the end PX did not even make a try to use the community group.
    I think alot about these small details that people say here on the forum or via pm. I really spend much time at the end of the day thinking about what people have said to me that day. The interesting stuff are the details infact.
    DW re-initiated a discussion about a planned management system for clans (which partly was already included into the portal).
    I originally came up with that idea a few months ago but dropped it as i saw a security risk for the clans since this existing clan management system allowed all leaders access to other clans and even manipulated other clans information. This in my eyes was a no-go in my eyes.
    However... DW has put much energy in the try to convince me to use this feature at the Portal.... even after I have introduced my plans to use the current community groups instead.
    Why was that? I mean there must be a reason why DW wanted to use the old guilded clan management and why he refused to the community groups which offered similar possibilities for clan presentations (and other clans have welcomed this feature with open arms).
    So why telling me that we need a clan management if in the end it is not even used by PX?
    - getting free information about other clans
    Why using an insecure plugin instead of the current community groups?
    - getting access to other clans information and manipulating it as the plugin has no limitations (a possible reason but even I would question that)
    - after visiting the PX forum it appears more likely for me that DW took a look at the features of the guiled clan management (like all clan leaders he had access to it) just to notice that it can be used to present ranks, jobs and medals inside the clan
    so with other words... a tool to praise and present themselves
    looking at the PX website you have a real problem to see the forum posts between all these medals and ranks and whatever that is.
    This would bring me back to the mentioned details.
    When telling the leaders that the clan management and its ranks have to be standardized as i am not able to created individual stuff for every clan DW replied with "It is standard, PX standard." (the clan leaders can re-read this thread and confirm this if they wish).
    That is the only feature that the current community groups do not have... ranks and medals for clans and that is the only reason why PX made a 180° turn when deciding against the clan management which turned into the community groups.
    having seen the comments on the PX site it is unquestionable that they see themselves has the heroes which dominated CF and nobody was able to beat them
    would it be too hard if i ask now which of the CF clans did not have a war like situation with PX or were forced to give in in one of the numerous ultimatums that appeared over the past 4 years (just because of them outnumbering others)?
    all is just about power... and presenting it


    some try to share it, others want to have it and the few which deserve it get in the line of fire
    the small details reveal everything... but unfortunately it is often too late


    btw. (sticking to tihs example)
    from the idea of the centralized clan management where all players can get information about the community clans to the current community groups it took 5 months where the clans where involved from the first minute.
    despotism... right?


    Edit by
    Edit due to Ryleous' post:
    It is true that not all members should be held responsible for the actions of their leaders.
    Very often clan members have to rely on the information that they get from their command and do what they are ordered to do.
    If such information is right or wrong is hard to see if you are being told better not to visit the SWAT Forum (something that happened inside PX -> confirmed by DW himself).
    I dont think the normal PX members are to blame... they just did not know better.
    If you are getting taught to hate the day will come that you see nothing but hate... but the world is full of so much more.
    PX member which wish to break the illusion and the a different side of the story are welcome to be a part of our community.

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    Only dead fish swim with the stream.
    Don't discuss with idiots. They only drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience there.


    This is ten percent luck,
    Twenty percent skill,
    Fifteen percent concentrated power of will,
    Five percent pleasure,
    Fifty percent pain,
    And a hundred percent reason to remember the name!

    That was a long list about PX and/or DW's behaviour, especially counting all of that info is in public (more or less) and on the forum, evidenced, and it was just a "part".
    Now if we had to speak about the non published parts... well, 4000 posts from Daywalker have to be somewhere else as just 100 are visible for the public. It was interesting while I had somebody in PX sharing part of that internal stuff with me at his own will. But unhealthy for me and for that guy as well as he quit.



    Edit by
    Edited:


    And even more, as things were probably going out of control for their forum, that whole thread where he moved all our posts from other threads as well (including the Clarification one) was removed.


    Maybe because of the links of PX threads I posted where Daywalker was asking and answering himself (as judger, exectuor, etc) in the names of SA, UR, CFPD and DSC clans (each one with his own thread) , as those threads were locked ? Or as I shown that I got 4 warning points for a post of 2 lines in where I just stated that it's not a discussion while there are no 2 sides chatting eachother ?
    Or to preserve the history line of PX, so no one ever remembers what happened in real, and how PX acted in this situation ? (if somebody didn't read, DW's reply to Bond's considered post was an image of that movie where some soldiers show their asses to the enemy).


    Dunno, but I still got my posts in that thread if somebody is curious, I can PM them.


    Edit 2: The thread is back, and apparently it was Cro who tried to delete it, my mistake on this point. Though my post saying about the 4 warning points and links to locked threads where Daywalker asked and answered himself questions towards UR, SA, CFPD and DSC clans in different threads, was deleted, and I quoted it in a new reply.

    Chars: [CFPD]Michael~something (x25), [CFPD]~SQMS~{[(store)]} (x3), [CFPD]xfer, Event~Manager~Michael, StarfIier~EM~Michael, Event_Team_2, [GR]Michael[SP] and a blueprint of [CFPD]Sephirothis

    Edited 2 times, last by /V\ichael: . ().

    Quote from The_Cro_Legend

    Well OP I think Shockwave (PX) was doing a great job with events :P at least he


    well, in that case i have to admit my mistake and it honors you to mention it

    signew.jpg


    cfmoddblogo.png5904.png5904.png
    http://www.moddb.com/scripts/topsite.php?ts=4766


    Only dead fish swim with the stream.
    Don't discuss with idiots. They only drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience there.


    This is ten percent luck,
    Twenty percent skill,
    Fifteen percent concentrated power of will,
    Five percent pleasure,
    Fifty percent pain,
    And a hundred percent reason to remember the name!

    Well, I haven't seen him posting the results of an event in a while, but he did offered for it.

    Chars: [CFPD]Michael~something (x25), [CFPD]~SQMS~{[(store)]} (x3), [CFPD]xfer, Event~Manager~Michael, StarfIier~EM~Michael, Event_Team_2, [GR]Michael[SP] and a blueprint of [CFPD]Sephirothis

    Quote

    Daywalker's last double posting (15 minutes ago) were too much, saying all that about OP again... speaking to him about despotism as he has no power in PX's forum neither over PX (though it was already proven wrong), and etc.


    OMG
    Op was registered in their clan forum personally! Talking with them instead of simply saying "piss off!". Damn it, almost the half of the community now at their forum! I never seen that before anywhere!
    Who they (or he) think their are to flame after all of this?! ?(X(


    Just.. can't understand... Daywalker behaves like a offended child...

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    They asked for it, now suffer consequences... Many times they have been warned, even i know that. Although, there are few people that i feel sorry for(HERO, ShockWave). But PX as a whole deserved this.

    Don't judge a ship by the number of it's guns, but by the skill of it's crew.

    Well, PX Hero do speak nicely with others in public, though I never fought against him, I got some report of him being aggresive during fights... dunno.


    And well, looks like Daywalker keeps removing some of my posts that are pointing to too visible/obviou things. I got them saved, but not up to post them here, for SWAT they are history, part of the past, as how CF is for them(in their words).

    Chars: [CFPD]Michael~something (x25), [CFPD]~SQMS~{[(store)]} (x3), [CFPD]xfer, Event~Manager~Michael, StarfIier~EM~Michael, Event_Team_2, [GR]Michael[SP] and a blueprint of [CFPD]Sephirothis

    away for 2 years getting married and having kids and it all goes crazy, at least i know why i can't get on game.



    Hi all

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    Hi Scott, and well, I think you can still play by having a fresh start, but ask OP to be sure of it.

    Chars: [CFPD]Michael~something (x25), [CFPD]~SQMS~{[(store)]} (x3), [CFPD]xfer, Event~Manager~Michael, StarfIier~EM~Michael, Event_Team_2, [GR]Michael[SP] and a blueprint of [CFPD]Sephirothis

    Hero, Nathan, Proto and some others were all the time while I was in game fair players, friendly and showed respect to others. This had nothing to do with fighting hard or or or bcs when you fight, you need fully concentrate on this. They from my experience also did very good merc RP. Was good have them on your side and bad when worked against you.


    @/V\ichael: please stop. I know you know what I mean.

    Hello every one . sorry I dont post a lot my english is not so good. not taking no side I am just a player who injoy the game even tho my ping is high from florida after all :) but I really like the game.
    I been in PX clan for about 9 months i think the whole time I was here in PX I didnt see any cheating or hacking from any of PX member, OP even know that I do not like cheating on the game one more thing about PX they do take pride about theyre skill as fighter ,and I do want to thanks PX for teaching me I feel like i am a little better fighter now and i am sorry sometime my ping coz for me to lag in battle. I do have one request if its possible ofc to give time for PX member to transfer theyre credit and equipment to untag char some of our new member didnt even know to what is happen I didnt know all the histroy my self. I think alot of bad things had been said already its time to put an end to this madness and lets made this a learning step to improving ourself and to server for every one. thank you every one , OP thank you for bringing us a awesome game.

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    attachment.php?aid=709

    After reading all of this entries (and of course the lots of "you did this, thats why I did that bla bla") - which btw. does not change anything since the past can not be changed.


    I personally, do NOT speak for the whole SMG-clan, or anyone else, but me.
    I personally did never have any problems with any of the PX-members, not on the forum nor in-game.
    There was one incident (like 3-4 month ago) which was based on a misunderstanding/misinterpretation and it got solved via PM pretty quickly. (1-2days)
    I also don't know any SMG-member having problems with any PX-members. And if they have had any, they got solved via PM and not spreaded out in public so "outsiders" could stick their nose into other ppl's businesses.


    My experience with PX was either neutral or positiv, since I play Crossfire (which is since 2006) and try not to bring personal stuff into it.
    Back then I was a freelancer, playing all RP on different chars. And I always got along with PX, either in combat or just passing by each other.
    I needed help, so I hired them. Same thing the other way around.
    When I joined SMG (10/2010) nothing changed. The treatment from PX members was the same, as it was before.
    I even did missions together with PX members. There was never a problem with it.
    I (as GR) got reports from PX and if I could not solve it right away I forwarded it through the apropriate channels.
    I (as GR) asked for support from Shockwave and always got it, when he was available. Same counts for other GR's from other clans.


    I have NO clue what is/was going on within the conversations between OP and PX. And it was never/will never be any of my business, unless I get asked for my opinion about it.
    Therefor I think, a statement from OP's side should be treated as such. If he makes it public, then I think only to inform the rest of the community of what happens.
    But it is still HIS decission as admin and owner of the server and forum.


    If people (no matter who) can't live with it, they are free to go anywhere.
    If people (no matter who) can't accept decissions being made, they can still go.
    If people (no matter who) think there should be some changes being made. They can make suggestions, there is nothing wrong with it. But if those suggestions are not going to be used/implemtented right away, then this is ok as well and will have to be accepted the way it is.


    Whoever is interested in reading whats going on at the PX-forum, can still go their themself and read themself.
    I personally think, there is no quotation or anything needed or even necessary to spread the "bad behaviour" from other forums in here, only to show "how bad" someone is.


    Some of you guys don't like PX. Maybe because:
    -they have beaten you in fights
    -they are more organized than you
    -they are richer than you
    -they attacked out of roleplay
    -their missiles hit better than yours
    -they suspected you of cheating
    -they did not report it the way they should
    -they tried to solve problems on their own
    -their opinion/pov is different than yours
    -ect...


    THEY are GONE! And now you can be happy and seek for others to blame for something.
    OR you simply get along with the decission being made and start learning from this happening, in order to make the future a bit more comfortable/better for ALL.


    I personally hope that some PX-members will return to Crossfire, since I'm sure that NOT ALL of them are the way, some people want them to look like.
    And if not. Well. Crossfire is still a game which is supposed to be played TOGETHER and not to be used as platform to complain about others being stronger or opposit minded.


    Those are my 2,5 cents