Major change in credits with 2.0

There are 9 replies in this Thread. The last Post () by SWAT_OP-R8R.

  • I admit this may be a noobish question, but:


    Is there a specific reason for the drastic change in starting credits and credits rewarded for SP campaign missions in 2.0? I'm sure there's something I'm not realizing, but it just seems rather unbalancing that by the end of mission 1 you have over $200,000 credits when you're supposed to be a peniless refuge from a destroyed space station barely scraping by. Certainly the prices of vanilla ships and weapons and ordinance becomes completely trivial, even while you're working on obtaining enough credits to level up - is that the goal?

  • I don't know why you're asking such a question. In my opinion, I don't really care. I have loads of credits by the end of the full Vanilla storyline in CF ^^ But a massive change in credits is what you would need for one of the best Crossfire ships, with the weaponry costs, + the armour upgrades and power gen, I think by my calculations, they'd be around 35M for a Chimera with 4 gats and nemesis/cataclysm, along with a armour upgrade mk10 and a Power genMKV.


    Besides, again in my opinion, I love having heaps of credits to spend in the first place, no matter whether you're a refugee from a blown up station ^^

    L+ Ratio

  • as Raiden said, for better ships and equipments u need a some more credits:
    ship: around 10 mill
    power generator: 10 mill
    shield upgrade: 10 mill
    armor upgrade: 10 mill
    better thruster: 7 mill
    better guns: 4 × 1,5 mill
    cloaking device: 250 mill


    u see, it is never enough ;)

    "There is no connection between truth and politics." Londo Mollari (Centauri Ambassador) londo.jpg


    Dark Phoenix Clan introduction: link
    Sigma 17 Rules: link
    DP Recruiting Office: link


    Events, Eventmanagers: link
    Event Rules: link

  • And forget about adding a cupholder. That's the most expensive part of your ship. Believe me


    I once put a cupholder in a Lagg (when they where THE ship to have) and it set me back so much my ship was grounded until I made the payments...

  • Plus side about the credits business, it'll make you feel a lot better playing CF then normal Freelancer when you know instead of making a few millions before being bored, you can end up making hundreds of millions and billions :D


    On another plus side, some trades could get you about 10 million a run, makes you even more richer =O

    L+ Ratio

  • Hello rockin982,


    credits significant increase was needed mainly for multiplayer, where you can have many accounts (on each one 5 characters), then fighting (especially PvP) can cost quite alot money. Next to this you can spent money on already mentioned cloaking device or put them into commodities needed to building clan bases. Multiplayer and SP cannot be separated in this, for SP you can after campaign end try buy some from battleships/dreadnoughts which some (without cloak) need around 250M $.

  • Ok, so granting that's the case, would it make sense to scale the cost of vanilla equipment accordingly, so that at least there's still some sense of accomplishment with obtaining equipment while playing through the vanilla campaigns?


    For example if by the end of Mission 1, I have $200,000 credits, then a $17,000 credit upgrade to the Patriot LF seems awfully trivial, not to mention that it can be bought and decked out before you even begin mission 1. Shouldn't it cost closer to $170,000 in that case? In fact as I come to it, it seems most vanilla items should have their costs increased by a factor of 10 to preserve the feel of the vanilla portion of the game, if that was the intent of the mod. Between quest rewards, trade profits and pods, there's so much money to be made that the player can literally have the best vanilla ship in the game with lvl 10 shields and lvl 9 guns mounted before they even begin the second campaign mission.

  • Hello rockin982,


    credits significant increase was needed mainly for multiplayer, where you can have many accounts (on each one 5 characters), then fighting (especially PvP) can cost quite alot money. Next to this you can spent money on already mentioned cloaking device or put them into commodities needed to building clan bases. Multiplayer and SP cannot be separated in this, for SP you can after campaign end try buy some from battleships/dreadnoughts which some (without cloak) need around 250M $.


    Ok, so granting that's the case, would it make sense to scale the cost of vanilla equipment accordingly, so that at least there's still some sense of accomplishment with obtaining equipment while playing through the vanilla campaigns?


    For example if by the end of Mission 1, I have $200,000 credits, then a $17,000 credit upgrade to the Patriot LF seems awfully trivial, not to mention that it can be bought and decked out before you even begin mission 1. Shouldn't it cost closer to $170,000 in that case? In fact as I come to it, it seems most vanilla items should have their costs increased by a factor of 10 to preserve the feel of the vanilla portion of the game, if that was the intent of the mod. Between quest rewards, trade profits and pods, there's so much money to be made that the player can literally have the best vanilla ship in the game with lvl 10 shields and lvl 9 guns mounted before they even begin the second campaign mission.



    The answers so far are not 100% correct.


    SP and MP starting conditions are separated and the balancing has little to do with the MP.
    The reason for the higher starting money in SP are the many complaints about Crossfire being too hard. We had request to make the game easier, especially on the first few missions.
    One way to do that would have been to lower the difficulty again... but since we also had the players which really loved the difficulty and the challenge this was no real option.
    So the money you start with has been adjusted to a level where players which require a bit help could decide if they want to invest in better guns or in a better ship... just for the first 2 missions.
    This way the people which wanted a challenge could still play at the higher difficulty and the players that required a bit help got what they needed to get through the missions.
    Its a solution that satisfies both sides. (we btw. have this higher starting money since CF1.6)


    The higher mission payouts were included a bit later when Crossfire got its own story missions.
    Since then it was rebalanced a few times.
    Main goal here was to reward enough money for the player to try out different new equipment and ships while playing the storyline.
    Of course the money you get from the original FL is enough to buy an eagle and equip it with the best vanilla stuff you can find.... but that wont allow you to try other more powerful ships.
    An eagle certainly is all you need to get through vanilla FL... but CF is a bit harder than vanilla FL and some players of course complained that it is too hard.... and after mission 13 it gets even more harder.
    So we increased the rewards to a level that is high enough so less skilled players get enough money to afford a somewhat better ship loadout.
    This allows players to try out different ships and equipment during the storyline and get even through the harder missions this way.


    The problem with balancing is that when you increase the difficulty you need something to counter it for the casual players which dont have the best fighting skills.
    Increasing the rewards is such a mechanism to balance out the higher difficulty.



    Why not increasing the costs for the vanilla equipment and ships?
    Because it is very hard to balance due to the storyline.
    Players require a specific loadout to be able to play the missions. If an eagle would cost 10mio and its equipment another 20mio you would most certainly run into problems getting till mission 13.
    The problem simply is that we dont have a linear increasing difficulty scale which requires a linear increasing loadout requirement. There are multiple jumps of difficulty due to the different NPC levels in the different systems.
    Next to that would an increase of cost for the vanilla equipment counter our tries to give less skilled players a head start.

    signew.jpg


    cfmoddblogo.png5904.png5904.png
    http://www.moddb.com/scripts/topsite.php?ts=4766


    Only dead fish swim with the stream.
    Don't discuss with idiots. They only drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience there.


    This is ten percent luck,
    Twenty percent skill,
    Fifteen percent concentrated power of will,
    Five percent pleasure,
    Fifty percent pain,
    And a hundred percent reason to remember the name!

  • That makes a lot more sense to me.


    Now I have chosen NOT to immediately go to the Vega system and get a kitted out Eagle to play the whole game with, resulting in just a large surplus of money while my ship and equipment is capped by what vanilla made available at any given point along the storyline, and I am able to afford the best of what's available as soon as I have access to it via new bases. So while that has made the majority of grinding levels virtually non-existent so far, I suppose it's not a horrible tradeoff, as I still get to experience the different ships and equipment at different levels.


    Now with that said, I'm assuming that the vanilla missions are designed to ramp up in difficulty much more quickly than they did in the unmodded game? For example most of the Walkthroughs make Mission 03, escorting the transports sound like a walk in the park, but facing 8 Outcast Daggers at once, with guns that chew through your Defender's little shields like it was paper isn't exactly what I'd describe as easy - and it's not like you have 6 Navy Sabers out there taking them down quickly either. This must be the difficulty that some people were complaining about, which has been solved with additional rewards? (Although still if you ask me, receiving anywhere from 10k-100K credits per captured pilot more than makes it easy enough to obtain credits if your ship is lacking ...)

  • well, you dont always have access to prisons to sell the pilots



    and id prefer not to judge about difficulties
    I played the original 13 missions in CF with a defender (as soon it was available) but I know the game well enough to do so
    players with less experience might need a bit more firepower


    its pretty subjective to judge only from the own point of view
    some people use the escape pods and make money... others completely ignore this feature... some people even do mining stuff
    there are alot more options than in vanilla FL and many different ways to play it.

    signew.jpg


    cfmoddblogo.png5904.png5904.png
    http://www.moddb.com/scripts/topsite.php?ts=4766


    Only dead fish swim with the stream.
    Don't discuss with idiots. They only drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience there.


    This is ten percent luck,
    Twenty percent skill,
    Fifteen percent concentrated power of will,
    Five percent pleasure,
    Fifty percent pain,
    And a hundred percent reason to remember the name!