almost no capital ship support.....

Hey Sona, you might remember me from some of my posts on the Lancers Reactor.
Personally, I think one of the tougher ships is the Nomad Attack Carrier, but I don't think that's buyable anyway...but it is a tough ship. I think I'd side with the nomads on this one if I could.

In the mod I've been working on, my toughest battleship can be cut to shreads by the nomads. (well, parhaps that's because they're using modified Mark03 nomad lasers with a refire rate of 4 each) and the battleship has an armor rating of 3 million with two class 10 shields.

ANYWAY... why not just get the better of the ships rather than try to get them changed? Might work better that way. (Fight fire with fire)
Besides, if you threaten to leave a server, chances are likely someone will hold the door open for you.

the turret thing is something you can forget
there are not enough hardpoint types in FL to realize this

how about making some new turrets ? since there are only the KUSARI ones .. it would be great to have rheinland, bretonian and liberty BS turrets ... as for me, they can all have the same stats .. but different look would be nice ...

no

I've played another mod long time ago a while, they also had different stats for the battleships and different turrets (lib, bret, kus, rein, order).

BS's
Liberty BS weak hull and less turrets (12), but more agile and faster

Bretonian BS average hull and more turrets (15), pretty agile and fast

Kusari BS average hull and more turrets (18), not so agile, and slower

Reinland BS strong hull and much turrets (21), but very slow and not agile at all

Osiris BS Very strong hull, few turrets (10), agile and fast

The shield of these BS had no effect at all. about 1000 shield energy with almost no regen.

The battleship fights where pretty cool. You had to be with about 3-4 fighters/bombers to kill one. Very cool for blockades.

To set up turret hardpoints so you could interchange all the battleship turrets, would require a serious reworking of the ship .cmp and loadout.ini files.
This would require more work than you can imagine to change this. Then to top it off, it would most likely require a complete player wipe to get the updated files to register. Worse, if there are any errors... you're looking at a major server crash with a lot of down time to repair it. With a crash like that, I shudder to think of the overall consequences to the players and their files.
If anybody else has tried modding before, I think you'll understand where I'm coming from on this.

I think it's best for now to let it well enough alone. OP-R8R has his hands full as it is. If and when he feels up to it, he'll probably give it a go. But for now, it's best not to push the issue.
Respects fellas.

What do you want me to say? Anything in support of capital vessels is something I'm for. It frustrates me when fighter-jock purists bother including capital vessels in a game just to have them for target practice... just to make supporting elements (cooperative players) feel like crap... it's Counter-Strike or Tribes II for Freelancer... enhance the lone hero syndrome and deny elemnts to enhance cooperative play.

In the mod I'm with, it takes at least a few fighters with bomber support to destroy a capital ship... for one, it's not like everyone has one, they're very rare and difficult to afford and are only in the hands of the Houses. Second, there's no reason why a battleship should go down easy. the late Iowa Class battleship is armed to the teeth with over a hundred AA guns... in WWII the Yamato was raped by torpedo bombers but only at the sacrifice of dozens of other fighters.

So... if you want balance... at least 2 fighters and 1 bomber to kill a lone battleship.... and that's being favorable to the fighter... I'd say 3 fighters and 2 bombers.

Battleships shouldn't and wouldn't be used to harass a single pirate terrorizing the trade-lanes, they wouldn't care about that... that's what police are for. Battleships would be fielded against other House fleets.

All that aside, this mod has some spiffy features that I'd like to see in other mods. It's not my place to argue a point that the creator of the mod doesn't want to acknowledge, it's his mod therefore his right, but I figure if you're going to include them at all, at least to it right or remove them all together to avoid the frustration.

I hope that didn't come out too crass... I've been up for almost 24-hours since I had to work last night... so I'm a bit out of it as I post.

Adios muchachos!
[13]

patience grasshopper.
Freelancer has been out about 4 or 5 years now..and by the standards of todays gamers..it's considered an old game now. (God FORBID) Even if this game is getting old, It still facinates me and I still keep playing it, modding it and adding stuff to it.

I do agree that battleships should be incredibly tough to take down. That no lone fighter should be able to take it down. (Hurt it badly if it hits a critical part of the ship) . Historically, sometimes a lone fighter can sink a battleship. (Doolittle proved that, but in that case the target ship wasn't shooting back at him or he probably would have been toasted)

A lone "Sailfish" Biplane crippled the Bismark (Sorry OP-R8R) and made it possible for the British Navy to finish it off.

One suggestion I could offer is this:
In what I'm doing, the battleships have incredible hull strengths..so no lone fighter is going to be able to kill it anyway. Even if you get the shields down, the hull strength alone will take an extended beating. IF it's equipped with fast tracking defense missles, a fighter wing is going to have an extremely difficult time trying to take it down.
However, an exception to this is the Sunslayer Torpedo.
Capable of 250,000 hull, 125,000 energy damage. 500-750 blast radius. (remember I said my PB3 has 6,000,000 hull) . Also consider the price of using Sunslayers..at 3 million per torpedo, you're not likely to dispense them like candy or you'll go bankrupt buying a new set of them for that purpose. (THATS THE BALANCE)
Hit a capital ship with that, if it doen't kill the battleship, it will certainly knock all the weapons off of it leaving it vulnerable to attack. So, when you're faced with purchasing all new equipment for your battleship..THAT gets expensive when the prices are adjusted properly.
However, planet diving or star kissing sort of destroys the true Role Play aspect of taking damage and having to incure the cost of repairs which for all practical purposes should cost millions. Players have to be more "honorable" to make that Role Play aspect worth while.
Sure, nobody wants to have to go back and buy all new equipment again..so they "cut corners" . I ask you, where is the Role Play in that? If I had it my way, I'd remove the damage factor of planets and stars so players on a multiplayer server could not commit suicide. Then, they'd be forced to go back and get repairs.
I'd have it set up in such a way, that when equipment is lost during a fight and the ship is finally destroyed, the player flying the ship respawns, but without the equipment that was lost before his ship was destroyed.

In reality, battleship armor should reflect some kind of "real world" statistics. Hit points of less than 100,000 just don't do that. They should always be in the millions.
I haven't looked at the Crossfire Ships in a very long time, so I can't say anything as to how they're presently coded.

OP-R8R has his reasons for leaving the ships the way they are right now. Like I said, making changes takes a lot of work. Basically, I think they're meant more like a "Clan Status Symbol" than a true combat ship.
If one particular battleship seems more powerful than others, then just defer to use that ship instead.

If all else fails, do what I did...learn to mod and code.
I don't know how old you are, but I'm 52. (old fart)
Since I began learning how to do stuff with Freelancer, I'll probably keep playing it until I go blind or die first.

good old bismark... i miss her

not to mention that the black pearl was finished by a sea monster

in the end you can take it like you want.... but the ships in CF are balanced very well... the fighters in the same way as the freighters or capital ships
and changes which will unbalance a group of battleships wont happen... not to mention that i dont want to see too many of them flying around since they are a big reason for lag on servers

and patience is something ppl really need to learn
coz this mod creator here also has to work in RL and from time to time this mod creator wants to have some private life aswell
not to mention that this mod creator did spend about 200h in the past 3 weeks to create an update and to find out what happened to LR

There's something I will allways respect.

Btw, any ideia of what happened with LR?

does anyone have an idiea where can I get similar suport about editing, specialy the .sur files.

About the more realistic thing, Rankor, we are all here to have fun, I agree that a BS should cost 1.9 bil, and should cost some more 10 bill to equip it, but need to get new equip everytime it dies, outch that would be to much.

as for me .. i like the ships in the FL the way they are .. all buggs are removed thx to our beloved creator ...

if you want , you can (well, i am) see this situation from economyc place:
you must put the unlimited wishes IN the limited possibilities ... so .. dont overload our OP

Argos, thanks for reminding me about the real costs.
I must be thinking in early 1900's money terms...LOL
when battleships cost only in the millions. (hundreds of millions ? ) and equipment cost in the hundreds of thousands. Geeesh... good thing it's only a game, aye?

why do you need to get support for surs? O_o

not to mention that at LR are 4 different tutorials about surs... 2 are completely wrong... one is "half" wrong... and the last one is simply to complicated

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So... if you want balance... at least 2 fighters and 1 bomber to kill a lone battleship.... and that's being favorable to the fighter... I'd say 3 fighters and 2 bombers.

[SIZE=3]Absolutely agree with Tolderian![/SIZE] :]

W.

what a bullshit... before you post something get some information first!

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#2: when swat you said earlier that no matter how powerful you made them they would still be easy for you to kill...it sounds like your PURPOSFULLY making them unbalanced in the fighters favor.

ever heard about skill?
battleships in CF have WAY MORE hull than fighters... they have very powerful weapons and move at a realistic speed
give me the weakest of the heavy fighters and ill kill a battleship... not because of the fighter is soo good... but because i know how to kill a bs without a problem

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#3: can anyone tellme why a dest has more turrets then a battleship? yet costs 40 mil less? ...thats just wrong......

because of the fucking balance!!!!
destroyers -> more guns + less hull
battleships -> much more hull + less guns

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#4: if you are trying to make battleships more even with fighters, think about other stats....they cant dock without a moor! should something be upped somewhere else to compensate?

a definite NO
fighter hull -> about 10.000
battleship hull -> 280.000
this balancing does speak for itself and battleships wont get more powerful - no matter how loud ppl will cry

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#5: I, and many others dont think it is possible, ever, to beat a fighter, or even cap ship, in a gunboat.

and that NEVER was the purpose of a gunboat
gunboats are support units for battleships against other capital ships and not fighter killers

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#6: Your patcher must be pretty bad, in rankor's oponion, if you cant add 5 weps without needing a player whipe and huge server crash......

you have no idea about the patcher and what is all behind this so i suggest not to claim something about the patcher that is not true
and before you posting something about char whipes you better learn how FL does really work
because if you add or change something on the mod and dont make sure that ALL the player files (which means about 4000) support these changes then the result might be a crashing server
and that has nothing to do with the patcher... just with the way FL was coded and the stupidity of the guy which did such changes

you better learn modding first before you try to teach me how to do things

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#6: Your patcher must be pretty bad, in rankor's oponion, if you cant add 5 weps without needing a player whipe and huge server crash......

Hold on there... Don't try to put words in my mouth.
That's not what I said.
Changing .cmp and loadout files require a lot of work AND if there are any mistakes, that could cause a crash.

ALSO, as OP-R8R said,

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...if you add or change something on the mod and dont make sure that ALL the player files (which means about 4000) support these changes then the result might be a crashing server...that has nothing to do with the patcher.

In my own experience:
Such changes require completely new downloads and fresh installs of the original Freelancer for the updates to take effect. If you try to install it over the a previous version, you're going to end up with one hell of a mess simply because of file conflicts.