Crossfire Battle ships and destroyers

What to say about them in the beginning?

How weak they are?
How slow they are?
How sad they are?
One word: NON balanced

ISSUES:

1.Shaking/tremble problem
Due new R.R 8.33 BSs and DSs shakes so terrible that u can not hit almost anything during fight No matter u fight NPCs or humans.

2.Shield
Shield can be easily ripped out in a few seconds, when it comes about NPCs in Inner Core.When u have PvP against only 1 experienced human fighter u really has no too many chance to survive and win.Against 2=NO WAY
Actually 2 half-noobs are able to kill BIG BS after few tries.
in one word you are "down" when ur shield is down!

3.Hull
Too weak for the name^ Battle Ship or Destroyer...even with all class 10 things.

4. Weapons
Only what is worthy, but a lil bit to slow refire rate, just a lil bit, or projectile speed, one of this 2 need to be raised slightly!

I don't want to mention many different fighting styles, ofc there is a way to bit ur opponent but only if u a really really skilled.And hey, we still talking about 1=one=single opponent against BIG BATTLE SHIP...com'n

At the end, few calculations:

For example:

NPC calculation

1 gun 1000 hull damage, 600 shield damage with refire rate 3.03 per second:
1000x6(guns)x3.03=18.180,
and as u know they fly in a wing of 4, so calculate this with 4,
18.180x4=72.720 damage theoretically per one second.

Of course they can not hit u every time,so u will stay alive in Kusari Destroyer for about 10-15 sec and in BIG "POWERFUL" BATTLE SHIP up to 30 sec (25-30)

PvP calculation
depends of many things so i will leave it as i mention before, and its up to you to believe me or not.After all, u can check this easily.

Conclusion:
One if this things above need to be changed, maybe just this shake/tremble thingy, maybe 2, maybe all of this.It's up to you OP.

Well OP, give em more respect, they deserve it by their names, and by their appearance.^

Greets

Quote from keli

But IMO you can kill most of the people in 1v1 tho 2v1 is a no chance indeed.

Yes u r right MOST of the people, but i don't like to fight noobs and half noobs, just for frags, but this is another story.^
I forgot one thing, there is no moor in whole Inner Core, so u can not dock and repair ur BSs and Destroyers, which is really Pfffft, every time u must use Alt+F4.
Also YOU CAN NOT DOCK with BS (Osiris not to mention other BSs) in DK trade lines,actually, i give up after 5 mins of different ways of approaching and angles.

Quote from Michael

Yea, well, there are about 3 or more people on CF who nearly can't be killed in a Kusary Destroyer (ie me, a SMG and a LP)..."nearly" ofc.

Indeed they aren't very balanced, even they have a lot of gunpower and damage as OP said.... they can't hit very well smaller targets.

If you read teh CF 1.9 features, this is getting improved much, including more BS and cap sips... so just have a bit of patiente at complaining and just add positive ideas, not opinions

Cheers

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Michael i didn't mention ACES here, i'm talking about regular players and about people who need to be attracted by the game and possible stay here for a period of time, and many of them like BSs, however i don't like and don't want to see UBER BSa in NO WAY!

I know that u are skilled, but go and try to fight Aliens in INNER CORE.I will reward u with 10 mill per every head u bring in front of my legs^

AND pls stop to blah blah about positive ideas, only what counts are facts and positive reinforcement behavior along with some constructive critics.I have bunch of positive ideas but this is not the point.And i was positive and patient more than enough believe me, otherwise this post will looks much different after five days of persistence testing.

EDIT:
Dark Raven wrote:
But even so i like the way they are atm

Do you Mind to explain why?or u just kidding.Of course

Quote from Spiky-

don't like BS, Cruisers and all that crap; using those in 1v1 is easy mode and boring to fight against in a VHF

but in mass PvP a BS or 2 adds more 'pepp' to the actual battle... and they are in NO WAY too weak; if you manage to stay alive 2v1 against 'descent' PvPers everytime, anywhere then something is wrong with the balance (balance is already wrong now in general PvP but thats a diff story)

no changes should be made to capital ships and cruisers in CF's current balancing state (... they are fine as they are)

then you are not competent to discuss about this issue? j/k ofc u r welcomed

Spiky i can fight and win against most of "decent" fighters here 2 vs 1, even against some very good pilots but in 1.7.Now in 1.8 there is no chance cos BS tremble and shakes during being hit by guns so terrible, so i have u at my cross hair and i have a clean shoot for 1-2 sec which is more than enough for me, but i can not hit u most of the time.
And as i know there is no changes by OP side, so this looks so weird.
Also i agree with Shock about shield and hull, today this stats are to funny for BS.

And Spiky yes u r right.BS and destroyers are good in groups along with some fighters.But do u know for which purpose...only for "SAY CHEESE"

Just kidding ofc but if NPC chose to pick u as a target then LOL.They are really good in fighting against BIG aliens ships, but only along with minimum 2 skilled pilots.
For example if u and ur 2 comrades fight 1 alien wing, there is a chance to stay alive, but literally u can just sit and watch like a sitting duck.

As always we have a problem cos most of u guys mostly thinking about ur asses only, only few ppl here can be really objective, and obviously i need days to explain one by one and thing by thing, and at the end some of u will eventually say "UH YES WE DIDN"T THINK ABOUT IT" lol

Go buy BS and KD then try all which i tried and then come and discuss, otherwise...Guys sorry but i don't have time for your empty stories

We need ppl who really want to help, not to say anything just because they want to say something.

Quote from Huor

just discussing about it wont help Because the stats of those big ships wont change by talking^^
On one side you "complain" about BS are too weak because they are shaking low shield and hull and on the other side you "complain" because you cannot kill two of them

OP has asked for support in the beta phase for 1.82 - two or three weeks at all. Now afterwards you have time to reveal the stuff that should be done in those three weeks. So dont get me wrong. The next changes will be scheduled and done when there is time for it. I hope that reflects also OPs thoughts.

Meanwhile you could make detailed describtions on what needs to be changed - and not saying they are too weak and too strong at the same time.

Huor u can not see that u talking about same things?

An no i don't get u wrong, this topic has its own purpose.Of course for the next changes in the future-maybe.

So i just bring here one-sided arguments but from experience.Ok?

And now about description and stats (the reason why i opened this topic actually ;))

1. Less shaking or maybe without.
2. Shield >>>with more shield hit points 15-25% and with slightly faster regeneration.
3. Hull>>>BS about 420.000, KD about 120.000.
4. Speed and maneuvering i think this should stay the same as it is now (eventually some kind of temporary thrusters boosting or regular thrusters with faster, let me say enormously drain of energy due to mass of hull), baring in mind more hull and shield hit points in the future.
5. CM dropper as for every other ship, because this play role for NPC only, so in my opinion no big deal in PvP and RP.
6. Weapons are already powerful, so as i said b4 just slightly changes are eventually needed as the projectile speed is, and/or slightly faster Refire Rate.

Guys ur turn?

Quote from Daywalker

- improved hull will make the Bs more sluggysh (physics). A BS with an Armor upgrade has 560000 hitpoints, a Lagg VHF with an Armor Upgrade has 16600 hitpoints. The BS Defence and Flak Turrets are much more powerfull than anything a VHF can mount - ofc. when you place your ship as a brick in the water it will sink in a second. For all the other things - learn to use the turret view.

lol
First this is not the see, we talking about space, and how the fuck u think that i was able to fight against 2 or 3 opponents and win, without turret view.OMG again" arrogant day"?
And again u didn't read my post carefully, i said for POSSIBLE CHANGES in the FUTURE.
You obviously need bigger font size DW.

Quote from Daywalker

- better shields will help nothing - also all Capship shields are missile save - there is an idea around it, take a wild guess.
- when the CapShips get more Power they will completly unbalance the entire mod, also you would need to make them most expensive - otherwise you would have 30+ BS around the entire day, if so you would have to edit every account or simply start a char wipe again not to unbalance the population.
- a skilled pilot is able to destroy every target because of the firepower and the distance you are able to fight on.

-yes there is a honorable idea to F1 in order to renew ur shields or u have more idea for so-called "around it"...approach
-Yes more expensive of course, and again u repeat the same mistake cos u don't read my dear friend.
-yes i agree, but time is the issue, in 1.8 u can kill BS much more faster than in 1.7 due to new weapon power.However this is far away of any realism.

Quote from Daywalker

There are enough Cap Ship Mods around where you do not need a sparks skill to frag whoever you want, also mods where you do not even see the CapShip while being blasted. As i understand it - CF is a Mod where you need some fighting skills to be able to frag, no need to change it.

"Are you talking to me?" (remember "Taxi driver" and Robert De Niro)

Quote from Spiky-

seriously, when it comes to balancing and PvP a lot of people here should keep their ridiculous suggestions - which, if realized would totally ruin parts of PvP - to themselves

Bull shit Spiky, maybe Only in ur head, because i can not imagine to fight against weaker opponent in order to gain frags or whatever ppl do in the game.
Sorry but i learned about fair play early in my childhood, and i really do not need any rules or guidance for this.^
However there is no need to accept this kind of challenges, when it comes about PvP.

Again for all of YOU who read only last replies at forums, this is a topic with some suggestions and with POSSIBLE ideas for POSSIBLE changes in the FUTURE!

Now i will leave u alone and let u think for a few days or months, in order to "digest" idea in a whole.

Bye
i feel sympathy