ServerPolice offcial statement: Jack-Bauer

I wanted to reply in the other thread but magnet already locked it and that was good this way

reading the initial post of this thread saves me much time because i simply cant say much of that stuff better than above

but id like to add a short true story and a few questions

It wont take long until I can say that "I play FL since 6 years" (even if im not always on the server i still play due to modding)
3 years ago the BloodGuard clan created the Crossfire server after a period of time wandering from one server to another. Before that BG had various own servers (up to 3 servers at the same time).
The story starts with the creation of CF.
BG was the very first clan... followed by the IP (Ice Pirates), DC (DragonCorps), Chaos and several other clans. These clans learned to fight from BG as I did training with them. Basically you can say the fighting knowledge that you have is based on the stuff that BG once was willing to share.
In the years before CF BG dominated all servers we visited and even on CF this was the case until about 2 years ago (there are various reasons for that).
During the first war with the chaos clan much of the fighting knowledge that BG had (the BGA) was stolen by chaos.... when i say "much" i mean "not everything".
Half a year later the 2nd war against Chaos broke out and the only other clan which had similar fighting skills was R39 which took sides with chaos at that time.
Sleepy, mhawk, gunny and many others were worthy opponents during that war. But still BG had more knowledge and therefore better fighters (at that time even I was able to beat any R39).
Chaos had to leave the server... Gunny created CFPD after that war... Sleepy and mHawk got their 2nd chance and helped CFPD members with their training.
For a very long time BG and CFPD were the most skilled fighters on CF... almost unbeaten.
With the creation of SMG the old BGA (the stolen database) returned to CF due to relations between SMG and the old Chaos leader. (here i just repeat common knowledge)

It was pretty good to see how fast the pirate clans learned to fight from that point of time. How their skills improved and how their teaching methods fit to what the old BG leaders once developed.

Having had some fights (and here i need to admit to have used a different char from a good friend) I can also say for sure that the knowledge which returned is incomplete. I can also say that CFPD, the old R39 and the new BGs dont have that knowledge.
The BGA was removed by me before chaos got hands on it... to precice it the database was removed at the same time so chaos didnt get all chapters. Later BG rebuild that database leaving out the last chapters to ensure that nobody gets access on the data. Since the first chaos war only BG leaders had/have access to the final chapters and only the BG leaders decided who may read them.

Ok -- the story got longer than i thought ... but I took the chance to show you that no matter what you think how good you are... no matter what you think how much knowledge you have... there is much that you dont know yet.

Some of you might remember what a good gun fighter I was before my connection problems started... that i won fights against the best missile spammers just using my guns.
Some of you might remember that there was a BG_MarcBomber which was the best missile fighter ever on CF.
Some of you might remember that MarcBomber had better knowledge about fighting with torps than anybody else.
Some of you might remember that there was/is a BG_GalacticFire which did win more events in a row due to his fighting skill than any other player on this server.
Some of you might remember a BG_Spiky which was extremly good in maneuvering so he turned his ship faster than others (including me).
Some of you might remember the skills of BG_DonZardeone, BG_Nitro and all the others which took advantage of their good training and knowledge that other clans didnt have.
Some of the very old players will remember that there were times where there were very different fighting styles which are not used anymore... the players forgot about those ways to fight eventhough they were not wrong... just different... and maybe they are still very effective nowadays... maybe more effective then the fighting styles used atm.

And now some ppl have the nerves to call somebody cheater just because that guy is better than they are.
I know that jack got trained by one of the best BG pilots that I at least trained in the beginning.
I also know that young players often are very talented if they put much energy into a game (i once had a member in one of my old SL clans which was more talented than anybody else but i refused to finish his training because he was an asshole).
I know that FL is very important for jack and that he did spend much more time to do training than you guys did.
I know that nobody of you ever did have a single proof that he does cheat. I know that the SPs even checked his FL and CF installation to see if something is edited (without proof of cheating).

But I also know that since the 1st chaos war not a single new BG member has got the permission to read the full BGA Database.

Jack got a 2nd chance by me after he proved that he has no edited files and after he has shown more positive initiative to keep this community running than you guys.... why do you think you have the right to judge about him or my decision?
Believe me... I take this matter very serious and jack is being observed all the time... if i see irregularities then bye bye (and if there is something to find i will find it).

Maybe the solution to the problem is that you ppl spend more time online.... stay away from jack to prevent that you get an heart attack... and do some serious training again (and maybe think about which fighting knowledge you dont have yet)

and finally get rid of the idea that you have the right to tell me what I have to do or that you have the right to judge about others
the final judgement is done either by me (and i believe everyone of you should have my email, msn or icq#)... or if you have a personal problem with me you can go to XL

Excellent synopsis!

As OP points out, FL allows for many different configurations of controls and weapons, so one cannot assume that their own limited knowledge is the "state of the art", no matter how good they may be. Since I have never worked very hard at learning combat skills with other pilots, I have always been loathe to accuse anyone with outright cheating. I have asked questions about various players' sometimes surprising combat effectiveness, and have even been told of outright cheats by SP's from time to time. But given that my connection speed is up to 5x slower than many of the successful pilots, many things are possibly contributing to my own rather high mortality in combat.

While PvP skill is perhaps one of the more satisfying aspects of CF, fortunately, it is not the main thing, and I have learned to adapt to ace pilots as hazards to be avoided if I am not in the mood for a fight. If more players took this viewpoint, we would see much less frustration vented on the forums, and more people on the server having their own brand of fun...

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Originally posted by Centaurian
Excellent synopsis!

As OP points out, FL allows for many different configurations of controls and weapons, so one cannot assume that their own limited knowledge is the "state of the art", no matter how good they may be. Since I have never worked very hard at learning combat skills with other pilots, I have always been loathe to accuse anyone with outright cheating. I have asked questions about various players' sometimes surprising combat effectiveness, and have even been told of outright cheats by SP's from time to time. But given that my connection speed is up to 5x slower than many of the successful pilots, many things are possibly contributing to my own rather high mortality in combat.

While PvP skill is perhaps one of the more satisfying aspects of CF, fortunately, it is not the main thing, and I have learned to adapt to ace pilots as hazards to be avoided if I am not in the mood for a fight. If more players took this viewpoint, we would see much less frustration vented on the forums, and more people on the server having their own brand of fun...

You may not be an Ace pvp pilot CA - but you certainly are an Ace pilot - in my LP days the only way I was ever able to get you in normal rp was to hunt you down with about another 20 pirates - Hook finally got you in Leeds if I remember correctly - gf mate on that performance.

Good post from Simba -

I am not a very good IT technician and I have poor eyesight - i really dont understand how it is possible to tell if someone is cheating considering all the variables - just as CA said.

I would strongly recommend you say gf - no matter what happens in pvp and rp -

It's OPs business to sort out the cheaters (and integrity of the game) with help from SPs - our job is to enjoy the game.

Anyway - hope to see some of you guys soon.

OK guys i hate to burst your buble and rain on your paprade but i feel i have to say somthing.... cheats are possible and do go undetected... you can scan FL and CF files as much as you like and you will not find anything.... I can easily make a BPMK3 out turn and Lagg ..... not possible without file manipulation.

I have tried and tested this and had SP scan me.... nothing can be found.... Im not here to accuse people of cheating but to come out and say" this cant be so because we can check" is absolute Bull****. Wake up guys... it happens and is happening.

I am more than willing to proove this to any SP/Admin that still thinks they know everything.

but lets put this in to context ...... there is not just 1 player that cheats.... i have seen a shroud and an eagle and a Bullpup out turn and out thrust a Lagg.... I have also seen ships go from 0 speed to max cruise speed in a blink of an eye also not possible i have also seen these people scanned by SP's and for them to find NOTHING wrong .... so purely out of interest and to see how people were doing this... i reserched and did some adjustments of my own and tried them out and got a SP to scan me.... and guess what... he found nothing.

I apreciate that people use macros to fire there weps... i use them myself.... its not a cheat all you need is a good Gamming Claw or a good Gamming Keyboard they come with the software to do this.

so lets cut out the crap and all the it not possible lectures and actually deal with the problem in hand.

I find myself asking 2 things.... do i blame the cheaters for cheating or do i blame the rule enforcers for there lack of knowledge and ignorance..... yes i may upset some by that statement.... but thats how i feel .... as i have said many times before i wont beat around the bush and go softly softly as it has got nothing done in that past.... these are the cold hard facts like it or not thats your problem.

Slayer m8, Are you saying you let the SP's log into your PC and scan your FL/CF files at anytime completely unannounced? During the inspection the SPs could not find any altered files??

Please noone attempt to frame my questions as a flame. Slayer knows that I wouldnt flame him. I ask the questions because I am a PC noob and don't understand how anyone can cheat after SP's can look at the files unannounced in the suspect's PC.

If anyone would give complete access to their PC to the SP's, then that person ain't cheating unless they know something this PC noob doesnt know.

Thats ok Burro..... simply put unless your are totally stupid and drop your firewall there is no way othere than hacking a pc that any SP can scan any files on your pc.... My firewall allows FL to broadcast... remote acsess incomming transmissions are blocked as with most good firewalls, I use Zone Alarm firewall these days since i got hacked 3 times about 2 years ago from someone on CF whilst ingame.... zone alarm detects anything unusual whilst im playing online... i have had it twice while playing CF that zone alarm kicked in and shut my inet down because someone was trying to acsess my pc from CF (as a side note there ip was reported to SP and dealt with).... otherwise we could have people looking where ever they like on your pc.

For and SP to state that can check files on your pc is rediculous... either they are lying or they are hacking your pc which is illegal..... Just because SP's are approved by OP to do there job does that mean we should open up our pc's to people we dont know to search through files on our own pc.... i think not.

The only true way to scan for file manipulation is for the game software to come with that built in... then the scannng is done internally in ur pc and any incompatibilites are then broadcast to the server. software like BattleEye and othere anti cheat software does this.

Also lets be honest.... have you looked through your FL files and Folders.... i have took me ages... could you imagine going through every line of programming and comparing values line by line... would take you probably 24 to 48 hours to do.

No m8. Jack allowed software so that SP's can log onto his PC that allowed them to scan all of his files at anytime.

I know I wouldnt allow that for my PC but Jack did, from what I understand.

Good thing my PVP sux lol

ok burro ill put it this way.... i can change values on nudge force and turning keep a copy on my original not pad file.... i could give remote acsess to an sp and copy over that not pad file in 1 second if that..... not hard to do .... this note pad file is 800kb so i could over write and modified note pad file quicker than you could OK the remote link.

So basically it prooves nothing.... but i can proove how its done and how quick i can put my file back to normal.

Ok I understand a bit better. Thank you for explaining it to me.

Oops, I am sorry Simba. I should not have posted here when you asked us not to.

That`s classic human psichology. If you tell them not to do something they DEFINATELY will do it.

Hmm actually no Simba i dont think your a moron if i did i would have told you by now:) but like i say there is a serious lack of knowledge when it comes to cheating and how to cheat..... i am willing to show you... walk you through the whole procdure and also show you how a cheat is possible and for it to go undetected by SP's even if you were to scan me while im playing....

I will not post the instructions in public otherwise we would have everyone doing it..... but i am prepared to show a selected few....

Yes i appreciate you didnt want anyone to reply on this topic.... but the information you were giving people was and is incorrect.... by alll means tell people the truth aslong as your 100% sure what you are telling them is right.

If you ask me does Jack cheat.... i would have to say at this moment in time i wouldnt know for sure as i havent pvp with him.... i would say yes he has cheated in the past ...... no i havent shouted and screamed about it ..... i take some sort of self satisfaction when i beat a cheat in pvp ..... have i beaten jack in pvp yet .... well in the 4 pvps ive had with jack the answere is no.... but cheat or not give me the time to train and get back to my old self again i could beat him.

Could a mod plz lock this thread. First 2 posts make sense, the rest is just... Why do so many ppl post about CF which they gave up playing already or taking a break from.
always this "in the past " or "before 1.7" , who cares...play or let it be. stop judging about things u didn't even see with your own eyes and especially not in public.

Doom just to bring you upto speed... as it seems that you have been asleep for the last 8 months or more.... SWAT forum is a gamming forum not just for CF ... yes ok i havent played for a month doesnt mean im not entitled to an oppinion .... so either you are nervous to what i can disclose or you think cheating cant be done.

well thats the problem Doom i have seen people cheat with my own eyes and not just fighting against me but with otheres to.... im not here to judge Jack as i have already said i havent pvp with him recently.... im here to say that it does happen and thats a fact.

It just seems as if its yet another problem that some feel should be swept under the carpet and forgotten.

@ Simba if you get a min jump on MSN and i will explain more.

i dont caref u think im total noob to the internet, computer and everything else related to it. Since u already cheated yourself here, i dont need to tell u, but there's plenty of youtube videos were kiddies explain other kdidies how to cheat (most games dont allow ini editing...), so yes, i think there might be a really tiny bit of a chance that someone is cheating.
But if u would have read Simba's post completely, or trusted in OPs / Simba's judgement (both arent new to computers either...) your posts would delete themselves in the next 5 sec.

'nuff

I never said you were a total noob... infact i dont bothere myself to think anything about you .... i have never had a problem with you in the past Doom so i never judge you.

I agree there are kiddies out there now that have vids on utube exlaining how to cheat ..... so what do you do... well you either pretend its not happening ... you open up the server to people modding there ships .... which i think could be quite interesting or you come up with somthing that stops the adjustments being made..

As we all know gamming has changed cheats/trainers/ini file adjustments are available to all games these days ..... so for FL and CF what is the sollution to this?

Im sure i have read somewhere that another FL mod team are or have worked on a good sollution to this.... i cant remember which mod team it was or either where i read this.

Just to clarify im not pointing the finger at anyone .... im not here to start a flame war....im here to bring my findings to light and to show those that may not fully know how .... in hope that the SWAT team can combat this problem or atleast reduce the chances of it happening..... this is not purely just a CF problem this is a Gamming problem world wide.... I would rather play a game where no one cheats ..... im sure some people have played C&C Generals had a few online skirmishes and have scratched there head and stared in amazement at there screen when a surge of 20 tanks come storming at your base and you have had the chance to build 1 power factory .... that was the worse game i have ever played on when it comes to cheating.

All in all, the cheating does happen. Sad but true.

All in all, some people here choose to ignore issues instead of discussing them in a civilized manner and resolving them.

All in all, we have some good players here, but what I find comical are the one's who voice their opinion here in the forum, but choose NOT to lead on the server to make it a better place and in fact, do just the opposite.

And don't forget, "my brother was using my account"

If anyone has an opinion here, which they think can better the server/community, then step up and start being a leader, not sitting in the seats and shouting.

what a piece of shit

Slayer I really suggest that you shut up now
Not only that you commited that you did cheat on CF (no matter for which purpose) you did even spoil how you did cheat infront of the entire community

ignoring that shit I can only say that you do very good demoralizing the players of this community by (to a big part) false claims and half true knowledge.

The original copy of CF has a build in cheat protection which prevents editing sensitive files inlcuding the one you described. Depending on which files get edited CF either wont even launch or it gets unplayable due to missing content and crashes.
That this cheat protection worked very good and still works unless someone spends much time with editing is proven by many mails and posts here on this forum asking me to remove this kind of protection.

Furthermore you have absolutly no idea about how the SPs work... which rights they have... what tools they can use and which logs they can view.
Besides one SP which has access to console logs the others can only judge by what they see ingame and this is intentionally as I doubt that they have the technical skills to find evidence of cheat on such logs.
Other than the SPs I have direct access to the server and access to ALL logs and tools. And IF someone is cheating then I can guarantee that I can see it.
So stop telling me or the SPs how we have to do our job... you for sure have not earned the right to judge about our work... and you dont have the right to judge about other players on the server.

And to take away your illusion...
If i want to scan your FL then your firewall is unable to stop me. FL communication between client and server works in both directions (if not you wouldnt be able to play) and your DirectX ports are open for every incoming or outgoing data to and from the server.
So dont tell me such a shit about how secure your system is and what i can do or cant do. The only thing that i cant do is to scan something that has nothing to do with running DX processes (so dont worry about your private data... it remains private and im not even interested in that stuff).

I have enough of ppl which think to be clever without knowing the facts... without knowing how the SPs work... without knowing about my possibilities.
I am not able to check every player for cheats... but if someone is suspicious then this player get checked and I do decision for or against that player. But all this IS NOT YOUR BUSINESS!!!